180sx Vs AE86

[quoccy]

after owning a sprinter for a long time
i was thinking of getting something turbo
who here owns both a 4age sprinter and a 180sx?
would like to know what you think

-which one is a better daily?
-how much petrol the 180sx uses?
-running costs?
-and which one u like overall?

[marvis]

This all depends on what engine + mods and suspension is in the (r)/ps13.

Obviously a stock ae86 is going to be a better daily and use less fuel then a full hardcore (r)/ps13 etc.

marvis.

[cable tie]

i had a 180 (pig513) for four years....

great cars balanced quick and got some grunt.... mine had every suspension piece avaiable, stick welding and braces up the arse and handles great....
depending what your doing with them they are different... i blow 3 motors in that time and 3 gear boxes...

they use 2x the petrol to a 86
and they are much heavier in the arse and longer wheel base, pron to chasi flex and undrrsteer .....takes time to get comfy with them but the move fro 86 to s13 will be easyer than other way round....


i personally like the 86 better for me suits the way i drive on the street i struggle to use power in 180 and always letting off the 86 you just go flat out!!!! yay

both same price to modify but 180 or s13 prob easyier to find cheaper and mor modded to buy...

good luck let me know if you need to know more specific info...

[slydar]

-which one is a better daily? s13. ac, power, ect. no comparison.
-how much petrol the 180sx uses? s13. turbo, heavier.
-running costs? depends if you break it. similar really. some parts cost more, and turbo does complicate things.

-and which one u like overall? theyre almost not comparable. 1 is an enthusiasts car, only enjoyed for specific uses, by specific individuals.

the other. can be a fairly pleasant car for almost anyone to drive. yet still be a very capable sports car.

having said that ive never owned an s13. ive driven them though, and i would own one.

[wideslider]

I have had a few of both, The 180 is easier to drift and a much better daily.

Having said that, I ended up with a sprinter

[mfxae86]

180 is a far better base to begin with newer, irs, diff, turbo, cubes, parts are ez 2 come by and cheap the list goes on, but i like building cars and just love 86s its more personal choice than anything else

[GAKI86]

most of the answers are made above, but what i like over all is the 86 its got that innocent tame look, while the 180 says LEB INSIDE labeled onto it so its prone to cops attention.

[Rice86]

depends what your really after...cant let people make your mind up

13k in my hands....ae86 with works and a bit of rust here and there they say, or a 180sx Type X with 130km on the clock....

i want a daily and a good driftable cars, both cars can do exact samething, difference is, i dont have 13k in my hands right now xD\

180s and ae86 are ganna be same shit, you wouldnt want to buy a ADM ae86 over all if you had the choice, for 180s you do, there are plenty of type X out for sale...if your going 180sx, trust me Type X is the way, dont go blowing bullshit money on a 180sx series 1, might as well stick with the ae86

do some research on what you really want first then see how it goes, i mean, doesnt hurt to have both cars =]

[driftism]

whats the difference between a 180 s1 and a type x? besides the tail lights...

[addikt]

ive had both and i regret selling my s13 bad

[redsprinter]

hi there mate.

ive had both .. ae86 and a 180 type x .

take it from me a newer typex is going to be better in every way .. comfort(a/c, heater, powersteering) and performace ( turbo, endless amount of aftermarket support)

alot has already been said above, a 180 can be a heaps reliable track car / daily car . what i love about it most was i could go to the track all day and thrash it without worrying about break downs or upgrading any parts and then drive it that eveing to take the g/f out for dinner ...

with the sprinter .. every track day ive been, there has been a small break down of some sort. and this isdue to a dogey conversion previously from the last owner . i am making good power 160rwkw and now all supporting parts have to be upgraded to keep it reliable ... not really the case for the 180 unless you go stupid crazy power.

one thing i didnt really like with the 180 .. not really the 180 but sr20det's THEY SOUND SHIT .... nothing compared to a high rev-ing scream of a 4age .

i would still have the 180 if it didnt get ridden off by the gf ( not her fult)

i think a better comparsion would be a 180 vs a jdm ae86 .. not at a bang for buck comparsion but as a car vs car compariosn ... would be intersting .

[Benny]

I had a 180, I regret selling it due to loss of licence. It was the cleanest, most reliable car I've owned. I drove my sprinter for 1.5 hours and it died.

serves me right... i was driving unlicenced unrego'd unroadworthy..

[Dave]

whats the difference between a 180 s1 and a type x? besides the tail lights...

red top engine (CA18det or SR20det) as oppose to prefer vvt black top engine, also extra features in type x

back to the question, if i had the money a 180sx would def be on the market for me. They're balanced and have gd power. My friend pulled 236kw on just exhaust, intercooler, afm, hks 25/30 and a gd tune also sick cars to drive when you have the right suspension in :DD but ive always been an old school corolla/sprinter fan

[JUG-HEAD]

i swapped my 180 for a 86 bout 3 yrs ago, was the best choice i ever made. mind you the 180 was stock as a rock and the 86 was a fairly modified example. but you will see 10 180's before u see an 86!!

[kaibeecee]

they're everything an 86 is, which is fun, only more power and comfort.

[all torque]

Arguably, the AE86 with a 4AGE is a better driver's car. But I've never driven a 180, so I don't know if that's just a load of wank or not.

[letsgohunting]

180sx/s13 is overall a better car. stock for stock jdm 86 vs 180sx/s13 the s13 will destroy the ae86 in just about every way including driver enjoyment. A well setup ae86 with a good healthy motor is probably slightly more satisfying than a similar s13. Ae86 should use a little less fuel but not that huge of a difference.

s13 is a better base for all intentions, ae86 is more of a particular car.

[ae86hachiroku]

If you really want to be critical...

People chose the AE86 in Japan because at the time of popularity, it was because it is cheap, and I doubt because it was really that a fantastic car. Just like anything that eventually becomes cheap, such examples of it being now are S14's, Chasers, R33's and so on.

If you look now, the AE86 is even outnumbered in club level events, because it just isn't that cheap anymore. Look back around 5 years ago, nearly every entrant would have been an AE86. Only the people that really like the AE86 for what it is, will stick to it. Other then that, there's no reason as mentioned above, some people will think that a S13 platform is better outright in every way.

Though, I think an AE86 will always be more fun than any other car I've driven, but you really have to go and sit in both examples and decide for yourself, a lot of people's ideas can be mixed with different tastes, so it's not really an ideal way of deciding which one will be better for you.

[kaibeecee]

Arguably, the AE86 with a 4AGE is a better driver's car. But I've never driven a 180, so I don't know if that's just a load of wank or not.

if you haven't driven both solidly you're in no position to gauge which is the better 'drivers car :)

86's just feel more involving to drive due to the old design without PS and with the live rear, requiring stiff suspension etc. face it - they're an old car and the S13/180 is typically an updated version of it, in the same vain anyway

[Axentrik]

Toyota vs Nissan.

[Course_Out]

I have driven an s13 Silvia and an ae86 (jdm) and own a 4age ae71

It goes without saying that you will get a very different sensation from driving an s13 to driving an ae86, like for like. Mates s13 has king springs and some 17's on it and it felt very easy and stable to drive, as did the stock jdm ae86 I drove. My modified ae71 is a twitchy prick of a thing that slides all over the place and is generally a handful. But its a track car more or less.

If i was buying a car to track and daily, it would be an s series Nissan for sure (probably an s14). It boils down to what you are using the car for and what gives you the most driving enjoyment. If your not enjoying your car then who cares if its $10 a week cheaper in petrol....

[driftism]

geez you guys are slow. they made a freaking comic and anime over the ae86... clearly its better.

/thread

[Rice86]

correction, that anime ur talking about refers to drivers, driving style, balls, then cars...

so in saying that...all cars are the same, just up to the driver

dont buy a better car, buy a better driving style and skills

[ae8zn6]

chicks dig skills... Computer hacking skills, num-chuck skills......


As has been said above, both are good cars. But it is always better to make up your own mind. Don't just take other people's word for it, go out and try things yourself and develop your own opinion

[Dfectd_Drftr]

its really what you like to drive... i have owned both cars and the 180sx is far better for a daily drive, easier to source parts for and has the reliability required to get you to work and back everyday. 86's are lighter, more agile and i presume they must be great fun to slide. however, in comparison, i see that the 180 will please you more for a daily drive turbo vehicle. good luck and either car is a great jap choice.

[Robo86]

slid a 180sx for the first time a few weeks back.
for a basic setup they go well. comfy etc, would make a nice daily.
i also like the fact that if ur trying to get into drift its so easy
coilovers, lsd, castor, cradle bushes and ull be able to pinch 3rd coming round turn 6 at qr

but in saying that i got back in the 86 and it felt like home.
86>s13

[rich_86]

i own currently 2 of each. one light modded ae86 (basic jdm 4age with jdm front coilovers and rear setup) and one highly modded (forged 4age, s13 front sway bars, full cage, 2 way lsd, all the other bullshit as well) one stockish 180sx (sr20det, hks front mount, hks exhaust from dump, trust suspension, blitz intake) modded 180sx (rb20det t04e garret, external wastegate, exhaust, fmic, half cage, coilovers, adj arms and camber tops etc all that gear)

as for daily i would definitely take the stockish 180sx even thou its a bit more on the fuel jus over more comfortable drive. petrol is not that bad on the 180s jus keep your right foot light. running costs are always goin to be more in a 180s then a 86. other then that u got to decide wat you want to do with the car whether you want a quick car and a bit more expensive or something fun and cheap.

[Intense]

I had the chance to buy a dirt cheap 180sx that was mint for 4k but I passed on the offer and decided to keep my ae86 instead. And I don't regret my choice for a second. I mean, stock for stock a 180sx kills an ae86 in everything. But it's not hard to get an AE86 handling as well as a 180sx and for power, well I've got as much power as a stock ca18det but my car is a quarter of a ton lighter too. Stock Silvia brakes are shit so everyone does the gtr conversion and 5 stud too. At the end of the day one is marginally better than the other but when you intend to modify them you can close the playing field pretty easily.
As for sliding you don't have to be as alert or on the ball in a 180sx, everything happens slower, transitions happen slower, it kicks out slower, they're a really good car to slide because they're just so predictable. The ae86 on the other hand requires you keep your wits about you and you have to think a few steps ahead or else you'll just loop it, that seems more fun to me, something a bit challenging :D
For a daily I'd prefer the ae86, you can hammer it everywhere and not bring attention to yourself. Do the same in a 180 and you'll be bringing in defect notice after defect notice and no one likes that

[crackett]

Ive had 2 86's, a 7, a TE72 and now an R32. I will admit I do prefere the comforts of the 32 more, but I much prefere the styling of old Toyota's. I say give it a whirl with the 180. You can always change back!

[Course_Out]

As for sliding you don't have to be as alert or on the ball in a 180sx, everything happens slower, transitions happen slower, it kicks out slower, they're a really good car to slide because they're just so predictable. The ae86 on the other hand requires you keep your wits about you and you have to think a few steps ahead or else you'll just loop it, that seems more fun to me, something a bit challenging :D
For a daily I'd prefer the ae86, you can hammer it everywhere and not bring attention to yourself. Do the same in a 180 and you'll be bringing in defect notice after defect notice and no one likes that

Quoted for truth - got rbt'd in the 71 one night, chirped and skipped onto the road because of the locker and noone looked twice!

I also love that darty "drop your gaurd and I will spit you into the fence posts" feel of a short wheelbase car, compared to the genlter response of an s13

[Vance]

For a daily I'd prefer the ae86, you can hammer it everywhere and not bring attention to yourself. Do the same in a 180 and you'll be bringing in defect notice after defect notice and no one likes that

i disagree. i got pulled over in my 2nd ae86 than any other car i had. i lost my licence in it, my mate lost his licence in it after driving it for less than 5mins.

if i didnt wanna get pulled over i couldnt rev it more than 3000rpm

[Intense]

So you're blaming the car for losing your license?

[driftke70]

why dont you just go halfway and get an ra60 and put a 3s in it

[stanzzza]

hi there mate.

ive had both .. ae86 and a 180 type x .

take it from me a newer typex is going to be better in every way .. comfort(a/c, heater, powersteering) and performace ( turbo, endless amount of aftermarket support)

alot has already been said above, a 180 can be a heaps reliable track car / daily car . what i love about it most was i could go to the track all day and thrash it without worrying about break downs or upgrading any parts and then drive it that eveing to take the g/f out for dinner ...

with the sprinter .. every track day ive been, there has been a small break down of some sort. and this isdue to a dogey conversion previously from the last owner . i am making good power 160rwkw and now all supporting parts have to be upgraded to keep it reliable ... not really the case for the 180 unless you go stupid crazy power.

one thing i didnt really like with the 180 .. not really the 180 but sr20det's THEY SOUND SHIT .... nothing compared to a high rev-ing scream of a 4age .

i would still have the 180 if it didnt get ridden off by the gf ( not her fult)

i think a better comparsion would be a 180 vs a jdm ae86 .. not at a bang for buck comparsion but as a car vs car compariosn ... would be intersting .


type x is the same as any other one 180 ,

type x were merely are the last of the 180's, The only thing different is the type x aero kit, front bar,rear pods,side skirts,rear wing, tail lights, the seats have 180sx written on the material,they use and different electric window switch and they have a slightly diffrent dash cluster and all type x's have abs later model s13's have that anyway.

THATS IT, they still use the std s13 sr20. all dive line and chassis is identical to other s13's they were merely face lifted to boost sales.

[Vance]

So you're blaming the car for losing your license?

no i was disagreeing with your comment about how you can hammer an ae86 everywhere and not bring attention to yourself

[FLCL]

As an owner of both I would just ask myself, "What s13/180 has over 86";
power steering standard
air con standard with climate control
independant rear suspension
lsd (turbo models only)
loads of interchangable parts with other nissan cars. bolt on goodness
power windows standard (apart from J spec s13's and 180's)
power mirrors standard (apart from J spec s13's and 180's)
optional sunroofs

imho the silvias/180 are a nice drive. im on my 3rd s13 now and i find them just so easy to do up since parts are cheap and i know em pretty much inside out. my 86..(after it stops leaking oil) will get driven just as much, even if it lacks; stereo, interior trim, power steering and floor bungs "I can see the road as i drive! oh and i can pee without getting out).
I basically drive what I feel like and mod either as I know i'll always have one to drive if the other goes off the road for something major.

[Sam-Q]

now while enough has been said about driving and all I want to say something about the build quality and engineering. Now this is just my personal opinion but during the decent amount of times I have spent under my friends S13's I keep thinking the same thing;

To me the S13 series overall is more more poorly engineered than even an ae86. Apart from being harder to work on I found that theres brackets and fitment of parts that just dont make sense. With the massive amount of hours I have spent under my ae86 I have seen how its been put together and I see part of the reason why they do things, nothing stands out of being out of place or just not making sense. Access to most bolts and parts is very good and its very well thought out. I wish I could say the same for the S13's, I found them to have many things out of place and seemingly not well thought out, and this is before even mentioning the mysterious missing peice of sub frame, anyone who has worked on an S13 should know what I am talking about. Anyone ever wonder why an SR20 is so shitty and such a tight fit into a 180sx? well apperently its because the engine was developed well after the body was and it was just retro-fitted later. An example of odd engineering is when I looked at part of the rear suspenion pickup points it has a significant bracket and then some pissy little pressed metal bracket bolted over the top. Me and my engineering friend looked at this and he suggested that during stress/durability testing they may of found that the bracket was marginally undersized and to correct it they just bolted the pissy bracket on top to make it have that little more. If this is true then I cant see Toyota doing that, they would of upsized the original mounting point metal. I know I am making a big claim saying that an old ae86 first released in 83 is better engineered overall than an S13 from the 90s but I am sticking to it, so flame me then

Oh and just for the record I think an S13 has one of the best bang for buck ratios out of almost any other model

[Arch]

If you are contemplating selling your ae86, then you should...

[lo_rolla]

I've noticed with working on Nissans is all the clips and plastic bits are brittle as fuck. The ones on my 86 are still sweet after 26 years.

[ae8zn6]

Uhhhhh, sorry mate, but the type X does have the blacktop with VVTI etc. I have worked on a few of them now (all 96 models if that makes a difference) and they all had the blacktop engine factory.

Plus the face lift etc (IMHO) is the best bodykit for a 180 available



type x is the same as any other one 180 ,

type x were merely are the last of the 180's, The only thing different is the type x aero kit, front bar,rear pods,side skirts,rear wing, tail lights, the seats have 180sx written on the material,they use and different electric window switch and they have a slightly diffrent dash cluster and all type x's have abs later model s13's have that anyway.

THATS IT, they still use the std s13 sr20. all dive line and chassis is identical to other s13's they were merely face lifted to boost sales.

[redsprinter]

ttz32 - no mate . i think you might want to double check that ...

s13/180sx never came with vvti .. only s14 and s15 model did... 180typex model came with a blacktop rocker cover ... that is all ...

[stanzzza]

Uhhhhh, sorry mate, but the type X does have the blacktop with VVTI etc. I have worked on a few of them now (all 96 models if that makes a difference) and they all had the blacktop engine factory.

Plus the face lift etc (IMHO) is the best bodykit for a 180 available

nah mate, seem to me you dont know what your working on.

s13 sr20 are all non "vct" engines.

s14/s15 are vct engines

S13 Red top SR20: 1991-1993 model year
S13 Black top SR20: 1994-1998 model year
S14 S15 Black top SR20: 1994-2001 model years

[ae8zn6]

ahhh, my bad, I assumed all blacktops were vct

[mfxae86]

honestly its all much of a muchness, the changes to type x make little to no difference to the overall package... oh and i have worked on and driven above mentioned cars

[ae86hachiroku]

type x is the same as any other one 180 ,

type x were merely are the last of the 180's, The only thing different is the type x aero kit, front bar,rear pods,side skirts,rear wing, tail lights, the seats have 180sx written on the material,they use and different electric window switch and they have a slightly diffrent dash cluster and all type x's have abs later model s13's have that anyway.

THATS IT, they still use the std s13 sr20. all dive line and chassis is identical to other s13's they were merely face lifted to boost sales.

I'd have to disagree.... Although if you compare both of the models, there isn't much difference, but the difference from getting a TYPE-X is that it probably isn't as rooted as the older series, interior will still be in decent condition, engine probably hasn't done as much km's, and generally everything else will be in a better state. Same deal with a 1986/87 AE86 compared to a Zenki 83, the Zenki will most likely be trashed out, that's why a mint condition zenki fetches such big dollars.

Having a TYPE-X is paying for the condition. How many older models do you see in really good nick? Plus most people swap type-x lights and stuff in anyway, because it looks way better.

[Course_Out]

Type X also has the five stud brake set up same as s14, doesn't it?

[Solo]

You're asking to choose a AE86 over a S13 on a AE86 forum...
Knowing your lazy ass, you're better off with the S13! :P

*endofdiscussion*

[mosqiton]

from my own experience I had a 180SX before going to AE86.
When I had the 180SX back in 2001 I had so many issues with lebs looking at the car back then and keen on stealing it. Actually in the end it was 2 guys from Fiji who tried to steal the car. So sold it got a Black AE86 and never looked back.
Don't get me wrong, the 180sx is a nice car but I love the light weight NA style where you can cain the f**k out of the little corolla and not give hell about it and it still will get you to point B. Fuel is much cheaper with the 86 and near no issues with theft.

However parts for the S13 is cheaper and easier to comeby these days than the aged 86.

[wide s13]

i like the 180 over the 86 due to longer wheel base for drifting nice smooth rather than quick snaps.
but daily wouldnt have a preference.
my s13 granny shifted would do 550km tio the tank as my rolla does like 380km to a tank so yeah. depends on tune etc.

[GAKI86]

^^ quick snaps isnt it where the fun is??

btw plus for 180 when it come to dorifto side of things, as you dont need to spend 1k-over to get both wheel spinning..

[Jonny Rochester]

, and this is before even mentioning the mysterious missing peice of sub frame, anyone who has worked on an S13 should know what I am talking about.

Well spotted Sam. I don't know what that is for either. Toyota vs Nissan engineering. It is easy to see which company is bigger, or is more picky about details.

But the 1994 180SX is a much better car than 1985 Corolla Levin GT-Apex.

Except for weight, and cost.

If you had a tiny bit of money (job at call centre at age 19, still living with parents), you would get the 180SX. For bling factor, best car for the money etc.

If you had less money, and wanted to improve driving skills, you get the AE86.

[Vance]

prices are about the same if you look around these days unless you get the crappiest ae86 around.

ae86s cost more to modify because theres so much more you have to do