The quad throttle onto 16V thread

[Sam-Q]

This is going to be the page for all questions on put 20V throttles onto a 16V.

First question is what throttle cable is used with a T3 manifold?

[Matt]

Pretty sure it is a standard 20v cable.

[Sam-Q]

standard 20v cable? as what's normally used- a ke70?

I just thought it might be different with the throttles upside down and all.

[Bustin_86]

A list of everything required and approximate costs would be a good resource for many to refer too.

[Sam-Q]

I have to do the conversion soon so I can fill on most of the details when done

[timpy]

Jap 86 cable works aswell

[wiltoi]

Mines using a ke70 throttle cable

[s13 james]

is it true the factory ecu can not run them?what other mods are needed for quads to be a worth while upgrade?cams and computer?

[Bustin_86]

Cams and aftermarket standalone computer is recommended if you actually want a difference.

If you just want show factor for mad jdm blowies a stock ecu will run em with a vac chamber but most people i have seen do this experience fucked fuel economy and a poor running car....

[meadan]

Im pretty sure this has been covered, bt would be good to have all the info in one place.

Stock ae86 throttle cable will work, but will be slightly long. Doesnt have too many kinks to create too much friction though.

There is no decent form of idle control except for adjusting the throttles when theyre closed. You could also run the 20v ISCV from a vacuum chamber to effectively create a vacuum leak to increase the idle when cold. I put in an adjustable valve to give a manual choke for me to adjust idle depending on temperature etc..

The T3 manifold adapter will not work with a fwd water neck without modification. Im pretty sure rwd water neck clears, the bypass pipe from the fwd inlet could be blocked off/welded up and it would clear.

The vacuum ports given on the T3 adapter work fine for the brake booster, they dont need to be enlarged like everyone says. The 20v vacuum ports on the throttle bodies do not give enough vacuum under throttle to boost the brakes, even with a vacuum canister. I think they only work under closed throttle, not sure what kind of reading they give if hooked up to a map sensor???
You may want bigger ports if youre using an ISCV.

Hooking up all 4 nipples from the T3 adapter to a vacuum canister is recommended. Makes vacuum lines neater and easier to trace. Plus balances out the vacuum signals etc..

You can run an aftermarket FPR with no vacuum lines hooked up to it.

An aftermarket ecu will make the conversion alot simpler. No cold start to worry about, no AFM etc..

If using a T3 adapter I would recommend match porting the head, and cleaning up the inside of the adapter at the very least. It is slightly bigger than the ports in the head, and CNC cut, so all the internal edges are fairly sharp.


If I think of more I will post them up...

[s13 james]

thanks that answered all my questions pretty much,its way more involved than i thought

[meadan]

It is by no means a hard conversion, just needs a little bit of planning.

I do think a standalone ecu should have preference over this though...or at least be done at the same time.

[s13 james]

true,ill keep reading up on it,thanks again

[Golberg]

You could also run the 20v ISCV from a vacuum chamber to effectively create a vacuum leak to increase the idle when cold.

I'm afraid I'm going have to call you up on that one.

The ISCV is a very specialised vavle, its not on or off it is infinitely variable. Us such you need the correct ECU to control it. A 16v ECU does not posess the ability to control an ISCV nor can you control it manually.

An alternate idea is to run a simple VSV off the existing Cold start injector switch to have very basic cold idle functionality.

[Jip86]

rwd water pipes definitely clear.

ae71 throttle cable is too short, ke70 cable is longer than ae86 but can be shortened and a new bike cable ferrule fitted. that's the bit on the end and its what I've done.

[Matt]

Seeing this is an information gathering thread...

I've heard of people using a 16v ecu with quads... Used a 20v TPS but wired it backwards.

[H8CHIR6KU]

I'm afraid I'm going have to call you up on that one.

The ISCV is a very specialised vavle, its not on or off it is infinitely variable. Us such you need the correct ECU to control it. A 16v ECU does not posess the ability to control an ISCV nor can you control it manually.

An alternate idea is to run a simple VSV off the existing Cold start injector switch to have very basic cold idle functionality.

i think what he is saying is just use the 20v iscv hooked up vacuum wise but not electrically.
without it plugged in it is open slighlty creating a vaccum leak. i couldnt get my 20v to idle well without it.
after i connected it up idle sat perfectly at 800rpm without it wired up.

[meadan]

i think what he is saying is just use the 20v iscv hooked up vacuum wise but not electrically.
without it plugged in it is open slighlty creating a vaccum leak. i couldnt get my 20v to idle well without it.
after i connected it up idle sat perfectly at 800rpm without it wired up.

yes, sorry this is what I meant.

Though hooking up to a simple valve would be interesting. On my setup I found that using one 5mm vacuum line out of the canister didnt create enough of a leak to raise the idle much when cold. Im yet to hook up a valve with ports for bigger vacuum lines like the 20v ISCV.

Using a 5mm line with a simple bleed type valve setup I managed to get my idle like this.
-Cold, valve closed......500rpm
-Cold, valve open........700rpm
-Hot, valve closed........850rpm
-Hot, valve open..........1100rpm

Obviously in different weather it varied, and my idle is very rough with the cams so it would be interesting how it would be with stock cams.

[Jip86]

Seeing this is an information gathering thread...

I've heard of people using a 16v ecu with quads... Used a 20v TPS but wired it backwards.

yep,
tps side > loom side
brown > yellow
Blue > red
Red > Blue
Yellow > brown

there is a really good write up on one of the "other forums" if you want me to post a link

[H8CHIR6KU]

post the link up so we can all read please

[Jip86]

http://www.twincam.org/topic/26291-diy-20v-quads-on-16v-4age/

after re-reading that i think it could make a good base for an improved write up. there is a couple things im doing different for example he drills another set of holes in the adapter where i enlarged the existing to 1/8 BSPT and run a vacuum manifold with all quads connected, brakes, fuel reg and map sensor.

FYI im running 7age, cams and Adaptronic

[Slimer86]

Sam, how about drill and tap the #1 and 4 throttle adaptors after the throttle bodies to replicate the OE setup in the AE101/111 for dual supply to the brake booster?
This would be better for brake booster pressure in comparison to the T3 4x 2mm nipples surely (even with vacuume canister).
The Blacktop only has a 2mm slot milled from each throttle between the head and manifold for the throttles to provide vac to the Map sensor.

If you haven't got a blacktop manifold there (or seen one) shoot me a PM and Ill send it over.

[Sam-Q]

good idea slimmer, I will need to find out if this person is going to run map or tps based tuning.