4AGE cams......choices, dyno results and discussions!!!

[sundee]

i had this setup in my car.. bigport 16v 264' cams with adj gears (so they say) Ae111 quads but it was running an SAFC from Japan and stock BIGport ECU.
all vacume lines fed into a small plenum then 2 feeds out of it.

it had no vacume lines hooked to the vacume sensor, it went to the charcol canister behind the front drivers headlight.

i hooked it up to the vacume sensor one day and the idle went all irratic so i just disconnected it and put it back how it was.

it always ran rich.. but now im putting the motor into a ke70.. i am debaiting weather to go the stock ECU now that i hear it can be ran on the ecu alone.. 90 rwkw sounds nice.

it would be alot cheaper to.

Frak was it just a matter of dialing in the cams?
i might throw it in in the next few days and see if putting a plastic fuel filter in the line for the vacume feed

[Wiggles]

Awesome stuff Frak, thanks.

What's the general procedure to dial in cams?
Do you just adjust one cam a degree or two at a time and check the dyno results until the power band is where you want it?
How do you go about dialing in stuff like overlap?

[Frak]

To compare to the GE's these are the power and torque curves from a completely standard 7AFE efi vehicle.


Compare the power and torque compared to a bigport 4AGE, sure the rpm isn't there but it has more torque(everywhere) and power.

[Frak]

Thanks.

Well, years ago I would go to the bother of putting a degree wheel on when I started making changes, but the use of a dyno changed that. Really, does it matter what the cam timing numbers are IF you optimise it to get the best torque/power???

I have people say "what were the cam specs, 110/112.....what were they?", I reply they are set at optimal for that engine, you may say well what about next time, it's nice to have a point of reference, BUT all engines are different, I would just go through the procedure again, I guess this is the difference between a good running engine and an ok running engine.

It's like these guys that do generic tunes for cars that you can buy over the internet and flash yourself.....they are not optimal for YOUR car, last night during a dyno session on a 6.0litre VE SS we saw how fussy an engine can be, we were altering timing via EFILive and the engine was doing things we didn't expect considering the conditions.

Some people will say hey set your cams up at 108/110, that will be the best BUT until you have tried each configuration and have datalogged data for analysis it's all just guessing.

Remember ALL engines are different, I have had guys put cars on the dyno, they have dialled in cams before they come on, I say lets change them......"NO!!! they work best at 108/110", eventually I persuade them to alter, when they see good gains from optimising the cams to their engine, they change their minds!

What I usually do is put the cams in at manufactures specs, do a run, log as much as possible. Then alter each cam individually, advance intake say 2 deg, do a run, advance intake 4, do a run, then put intake back to stock do the same but this time retarding the cam then start the same with the exhaust cam.

Each run is saved, I then overlay all the runs on the screen to see what is going on, I then start combinations of intake and exhaust at the same time and check runs to see what is going on with torque etc.

This can take a while but you build up a fantastic database of how the cam timing can effect an engine. Sometimes the same engine type(4AGE for example) with similar mods will act completely different just due to one little difference between engines!

All engines are different when it comes to what they like, the 4AGE small port with the quads, 264's etc, did not like any overlap AT ALL, that motor was also very fussy when it came to cam timing changes, 1 deg off optimal would completely change the engine's characteristics.

When messing with cam timing MAKE SURE you know when the valves may touch the piston or each other, you can do with out bending valves

Sometimes you may alter cam timing and get some good power up high, at the expense of low down torque, then I confer with the owner as to what majority of driving they do, when you explain how the engine will behave, I have found ALL owners will go for more torque down low over a couple more kw's up high.

Generally what I find, is when you get close with the cam timing, small gains up high, will ruin the majority of the torque curve down low, for example a 2 kw gain at the top can ruin 2/3's of the torque band, this may be ok in a lightweight car with a close ratio gearbox which isn't driven in traffic!

With regards to using the vacuum chamber when putting quads on, I HIGHLY recommend some formn o0f restrictor/dampener inline with the vacuum canister/MAP sensor, I personally would use what the factory uses on an AE111, this I know works and works well.

[Frak]

+1

[charged]

Have to agree jamie, I cant wait to give my engine some tlc, a bit more comp and e85 and see what it makes on adams dyno

[Frak]

small port, ae111 quads, fidanza sprockets, I.mec rams

[kool mints]

Hey Guys,

Installed my Camtech 266 degrees 8.75mm lifts Cams today, can feel the extra punch around mid to top end and also revs nicely to redline as in before it would chocked up top end.

Also, adjusted the TPS screw next to the TPS sensor to over come the car from shutting down after braking. All good.

NOW:

Only problem i have now is that car would not IDLE nicely, it would be stable for less than a min and would just fluctuated and then the car would shut off on its own. By the looks of it, its properly ranning lean, correct me if i'm wrong?

What would i need to do to over come this IDLE problem? Adjust the idle controller?

Its currently IDLING on 1200rpm

Bear in mind, i'm ranning stock JDM ECU on JDM 4age 16v blue top.

Any tips, advice would be much appreciated guys.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers

[Frak]

Bringing back from the dead! Have a number of new 4age runs, and a few other 4cyl NA to compare.

[Tim.duncan]

do share! need to get you to do a run on my new 4 cly na!